If you're looking at poaching then you have to offer something better than the NHS...the hardest things for the private sector to compete with are 'job security', final salary pension scheme, a geographically small but large employer.

There are fears of with the private sector of being shunted around the country against your will, losing a contract and being mad redundant, loss of NHS T&Cs as a safety net.

So to poach the private sector needs to offer more than the NHS does..whether in financial or job security.

Generally biomeds are not always valued in the NHS so perhaps this is an area you can value your staff????...add initiatives on top of salaries like cars, bonuses, extra CPD?

Just some thoughts

Dave is right about things to come ... it will be grim (financially, and even perhaps, socially) ... and we digress only slightly, as (as far as UK biomed is concerned) I believe that the small (lean, mean, etc., etc.) ISO company will be best placed to weather the storm.

But poaching from the NHS? Not necessary, in my opinion.

Meanwhile, for what it's worth (and without in any way wishing to hijack Rob's thread), as always I also continue to seek out good techs, particularly (again, as always - nothing really changes) those with expertise in anaesthesia, laboratory and imaging (x-ray and ultrasound) kit.

Useful people are always required not only for Dark Side duties (where good all-rounders, "utility players" even - willing to put in the hours sometimes called for, and yes, able to drive the van when necessary - are most valued) but also those interested in acting as volunteers in support of medical charities (that this, those willing to work for the sheer joy of it, for nowt, or next to nothing). As I have said before, there is a "bigger picture", and the best people are not motivated only by money.

All of Mr.eastangular's points are valid. But they are easily dismissed as far as I'm concerned. Simply put, those with the type of mindset he outlines "need not apply"!

Very philanthropic Geoff.....
But meanwhile market forces prevail, and good quality staff who work for the NHS will only be recruited into the private sector if the terms and conditions offered are favourable. Quite simple in the vast majority of cases we all have bills to pay and we prefer to be employed where the remuneration matches the role (cold hard fact).
You can’t expect to offer a Rolls Royce service on Skoda funding..... Unless of course, you know different.....

I assume your remarks relate to the "volunteers". Volunteers er, volunteer ... that is, they do stuff in their own time. It's very good for the soul, you know - giving as well as taking.

Meanwhile Dark Side duties take care of the bills we all have to pay. Especially those of us lucky enough to reside in the UK.

But, since you ask, yes - I do know different(ly). But as I indicated earlier, I don't feel the need to open up all my secrets.

Sorry for hi-jacking Rob.
Maybe a little bit more direct to answer the question you originally asked.
What is required to "entice" NHS Biomeds to private providers.
To make a comparison on the points you raised

Wages........NHS £32k -£38k..........Private £25k - £27k
Pensions.....NHS final salary (safe).Private good but risky
Cars.........NHS ? personal choice...Private ask the Taxman !!
Travel.......NHS home every night....Private where am I tomorrow
Training.....NHS dependant/patchy....Private dependant/if needed
Promotion....NHS individual taste....Private contract depending
Holidays.....NHS 33 + poss flexi.....Private 25 when possible
Healthcare...NHS err NHS.............Private see Taxman again

The way I see it then Rob is if you want to attract a good experienced NHS Biomed what you need to offer must be around these points.

You also need to convince them they won't be out of work if you loose a contact, you wont be away from home for 26 weeks out of the year. You wont be expected to work at the weekend, or evenings, for nowt "Coz I do it ". You will have support and help when required not just " keep your head down and get on with it"

This isn't a dig, honestly, these are points I have seen that would need addressing if you were to attract NHS Biomeds.

This doesn't mean they are lazy, unproductive or "sat in their Ivory Towers", it means if you want to attract the best then you have to meet their requirements.

Post Agenda For Change, salary terms & conditions have changed considerably for the better for the vast majority of NHS BioMeds, certain areas of the Private Sector have been slow to realise that things have moved on and they need to tailor their recruitment packages to reflect these changes.

Dave's figures and comparison points look right to me, and I would echo his comments.

People favour career progression and the occasional sideways move, but if the package offered is basic compared to what the NHS will offer, it would appear to be a non starter.

You don’t need to be a recruitment guru to establish why you have difficulty attracting experienced BioMeds away from the NHS.

Are there any figures out there to back up Dave's claim that private sector biomeds earn £25K to £27K? The £38K looks like a band 7, there aren't many biomeds other than supervisors & managers on that band. £25K to £27K is comarable with band 5 which is unfortunately the working grade for most biomeds. But i agree that job security and pension are the main motivators for staying in the NHS. I left the NHS and came back five years later, dissolusioned with the private sector. The wages were very good but there was no job security and other T&C's were much worse.

Just to qualify what I have said Bill, £25k - £27k was what the "private" company I was working for were looking to pay.

They knew NHS Biomeds were on more, couldn't attract them, nd pursued other methods for employing staff i.e ex-military, overseas candidates, university graduates etc.

I work in the NorthWest. Most people of experience are Band 6, and have worked with quite a few Band 7's, not always in supervisory positions. I would say in my experienceBand 6 is the norm.

I've also worked for OEM companies and they were(are) looking at paying £25k - £28k with a generous package !!!

Most companies these days fill positions via agencies, these prefer to get people more towards the £25k figure, as a start.

Next time you see a position, contact them and tell them you are looking for a salary of £34k upwards. I bet you don't hear much more from them.

Interestingly enough many companies offer a "bonus" as an incentive on top of a basic salary to make the £ figure look more attractive. In my experience, the hoops you have to jump through to gain this "bonus" are unachievable and relate to not just your own work, but group work which includes the Sales side (so if Sales are down, say goodbye to your bonus).

Most BioMeds of any calibre will not require an additional financial incentive to do their job well, (they just get on with it) and such a "dangled carrot" would make a potential position less attractive to the job seeker. Far better to increase the basic salary IMHO.

Thanks for the reply Dave, I didn't realise that the salaries in the private sector were so low. When I was "contracting" (late 80's) my hourly rate was more than 1.5 times that of the in-house biomeds. I assumed that the private sector still paid more.