OK ... here's Idea No.14 (those of you wondering about the previous 13 will need to trawl back through my earlier posts. Enjoy)!

Being relatively late in coming to the internet, on-line shopping and all the rest, I realised early on (a few years back now) that the crunch (the nub, the Achilles Heel) of the whole idea of shopping on line (and, up to a point, "just in time" stock transactions) was and is:- the distribution and delivery of the goods.

People don't live as they used to, and Mums tend not to stay at home these days. So what about deliveries to private addresses? And how about the many folk (myself included) who hang out in "difficult to find" addresses, in shared accommodation, high-rise buildings and all the rest (that is, places that drivers of over-sized Sprinters* prefer [or pretend] not to know about). I'm sure I'm not the only one who has had to traipse to the Sorting Office in town (limited hours) just to pick up something that, as it turned out, I may as well have bought in town anyway!

Having just witnessed a Yodel** driver attempting to drop off a package at someone's house, I was yet again reminded of the need for some sort of secure individual dropping off point, bunker, closet (or what-have-you).

I believe that in some parts of the world (eg, the United States) houses in suburban areas have what look a bit like lockable "Biffa"*** bins outside, for stuff to be dropped off at. However, I'm not sure how the driver gets access to those (maybe they are left unlocked by the owner, then latch when the lid is closed following delivery, or perhaps each vendor has their own bin (?) - someone must know)!

So ... here's the thought:- why not have a window-less closet, bunker, bin (we need to come up with a name here) that works by "key access". The owner would have the master device (hand-held, IR, Bluetooth, whatever ... technology to be decided), and be able to program time-slots, access levels etc. The lock mechanism would be a solenoid operated sliding bolt (or some such suitable arrangement). Meanwhile, the couriers would have their own devices to access the door (lid) according to the delivery code (or whatever). Therein lies the problem, of course:- the couriers would need to agree on the details of the coding!

"It's yet another opportunity for thieves", you may say. But to that I would respond:- "in Modern Britain, what isn't"?

And ... our gadgets may as well include a camera (suitable triggered) as well. After all, what is less secure than the electricity and/or gas "utility boxes" that adorn modern dwellings in Britain?

Remember folks, where you heard it first (I only want 5% for the rights to the concept, plus 1% of the value of every secure delivery)!

* Other grotesque (but usually nearly empty) large vans are available to clog up the roads and streets.
** Other (many, in fact) courier services are available.
*** Other waste collection companies are available.

Hi Geoff,

Sounds like a really great idea - shame that someone has already thought of it!

Regards,

Darn it!

I wonder why I haven't seen them around then?

(must be the down-market places I tend to mooch about in, I suppose)

However, all is not lost ... those locks don't look very "high tech" to me. And "leaving the key in the garage" is not really what I had in mind!

I'd never heard of them previously but I remember seeing something on the news earlier this week about secure drop boxes that the AA or some other similar company uses to get spare parts to their service engineers on the road.

basicaly it looks like a great big metal wardrobe (normally at service stations and the like) with various sized lockers depending on the size of the item.

The item is put into one of the lockers and is locked through an electronic system. The system then emails the recipient a PIN number. The recipient then turns up at the locker unit, enters their PIN number and the locker that it relates to unlocks and pings open (whilst the others remain securely fastened).

I can't remember the name of the company that make them now to provide a link

You could give your drop bin an IP address connected to your wifi router and get it to call you when the delivery driver arrives. You could then remotely unlock the bin for them. A project for the tech savvy?

I hope that those lockers are securely bolted down!

It's an interesting variation. We could call them Secure Drop Boxes at Third-Party Locations (ie, not necessarily, and indeed probably not, at the consignee's location). Ideal for nationwide mobile operations such as, as you say, the AA*.

My own thoughts are more about what we might call Remotely Programmable Secure Access Technology (RP-SAT ... yes, that has an appropriate ring about it)! With "my" system, the recipient (owner) would (must) have absolute overall control. I envisage the owner having a remote control for programming, plus a key-fob device for quick unlocking on-site.

De-luxe** versions could allow unlocking via mobile phone, the internet ... or what-have-you.

The deliverer would need some sort of universal hand-held toy, incorporating technology which is yet to be decided!

* Other roadside assistance operations are available!
** Now there's a word that you don't see too often these days.

Nice one, Bill. We need to draw up a spec! It should include a provision that, in the case of power failure (the internet being down, whatever), the recipient should still be able to "open the box" (h'mmm ... that takes me back a bit) - they could always hold a physical key, could they not?


Yes, Mate ... that's us!

But, as an aside, remote control technology of this type is a bit of an iffy area as it plays into the hands (minds?) of the general paranoia vis-à-vis remotely controlled "terrorist devices". So we may have to limit our imagination to folk standing within Bluetooth (or IR) range of the drop box!

Unfortunately my tech savvy is limited to electronics, never had the patience to get into programming. Might have to have another go (if I want a future in this industry). I'm sure IT programming has moved on from BASIC. Any tips on where to start?

We're really talking electronics here, Bill.

And anyway, the cheapest version could just be a door (lid, whatever) left unlocked by the householder, then locked ("flipped off the latch") later on by the delivery van driver.

The trouble with that, of course, is:- what about a second (third etc. delivery) ... they are going to encounter a bolted door!

So we're back to something like:-

1) Security code (how many digits?) gets agreed as part of purchase procedure.
2) Householder enters this code in the locking system.*
3) Van driver uses the same code to gain access.
4) Code is disabled once door is closed by driver.
5) Householder returns and gains access using their own PIN (not the access code used earlier).

* But what if the code is miss-keyed? So we could be back to some sort of clever access code arrangement that does not need the householders' input at all!

There would also need to be a fool-proof way of locating the correct drop-box (door, lid) as well. Or else we're going to see even more frustrated delivery drivers chucking stuff over the hedge (or whatever they do). Each secure point would need a unique number (of course). It could include the post code, as well.

Programming? Visual Basic would be the one I would suggest. It gives you "pretty" results without too much trouble. And (or) if you wanted something a bit different (or more "traditional", but certainly more versatile) you could try BBC BASIC for Windows, which is available on line as a cheap download. Otherwise it really depends on whether you intend to have a go at "real" stuff, or just want to have a "play".

Meanwhile I've just realised that this topic links to this one!

There was an American biomed on other forum recently complaining that his services "weren't required" during the installation of wireless IV pumps (whatever they are). He was wondering whether he needed to go on courses for Microsoft Certified this and that ...

... my advice was quite simple:- be sure to invite "IT" to fix the pumps next time they fail!

In my opinion, "IT" is just another attempt at a Closed Shop by "those in the know" (or rather, like to pretend that they know). In short, just like "medicine" it is deliberately kept "mysterious" (so as to justify careers at inflated salaries), and any half-decent biomed tech worth his (her) salt should already be more than capable of sorting out hospital IT problems.

The "clever" stuff is in software development (just as it is with equipment design and manufacturing) ... not the on-site support of computer networks, the installation and maintenance of proprietary software, the PC's themselves and peripherals etc.

What stops an unscupulous driver making a note of the bar code and then walking off with the parcel? May be scales like those in the supermarket self check out.

There was a scheme a while ago where your local corner shop would accept the parcel and you would go to collect it when you got home. It was a combined scheme for easy package delivery and to boost the small shop.
Never took off though as there are no small shops left.

Bring back the days of servants who were always there to do things like this for you.

What Ho and a Merry Christmas.
Robert

And unlike using a technical solution, having servants reduces the numbers of unemployed

Who mentioned a bar code?

The driver should have no need to see the code itself ... just press the button on his (her) hand-held device. We could call it the "Open Sesame"!

And ... it's best that delivery drivers are not thieves (we could call them "Ali Baba") ... that way they're more likely to keep their jobs (and avoid going to jail).

Yeah, back in the days when Britain was a more friendly place, with many more decent folk about than seems to be the case nowadays, many options were possible (involving neighbours, local businesses and the like). But all that has changed now. No one wants to "get involved" these days. Or perhaps I have have just been unlucky in my experiences yet again.

But (lastly) yes ... Santa will be needing the access codes device, as well. But just for boys and girls who have been good, though (that should narrow it down a bit). The "scheme" (when being implemented) would even provide a fair number of jobs. Surely this is just the sort of innovation that Miserable Modern Britain needs!

(welcome back, by the way)

Just move to a nicer area and your neighbors will take it in for you.

To afford to live in a "nicer area" both halves of the couple need to go out to work.
Robert

You're not a Daily Mail reader by any chance are you, Webbie?

Mate, if I could afford to live in a "nicer area", I wouldn't even be in England at all! Or, let's put it another way, in the fabled "Geoff's England" everywhere would be "nicer".

@RoJo: "couple"? What couple? Anyway, it just goes to reinforce what I'm talking about here:- the need for a way to have stuff delivered when no-one is at home.

Meanwhile, back at the topic ... if anyone is interested in this sort of thing, and would like to explore the technologies involved a little further, I know of a good forum that deals with it all (and more). As so often seems to be the case with tech forums, it is based in the United States (but is none the worse for that).

PM me if you would like the link. I won't place it here as it's not really about what we could call "medical equipment"!

You can still post a link Geoff
This thread is hardly medical equipment related, is it?

Would be medical if this is the place for spare parts, tools and/or manuals.
Webbie to move to a 'nicer' area all you need to do is claim 'political' asylum, ooops sorry locals can't do that, maybe go on the dole for 10 years, 2 wife's and countless children would help.

When it comes to all the wishy-washy liberal hand-wringing nonsense about Asylum Seekers ... what you have to ask yourself is this:- why are they having to flee their country of origin? Or, if you like, why (in today's world) should there be any "asylum seeking" going on at all?

Can't say? OK, here's one answer then:- because they are dissidents (read:- trouble-makers) at home. Should this be my problem? No. If they had any gumption at all, they would stay at "home" and fight any injustices (real or imagined) from there.

This is a small, and already overcrowded island, and many (most) of us are fed up (to put it mildly) with the dross of the world washing up on our shores. They were trouble-makers back there, and trouble-makers they remain.

Regarding your second point (about "benefits breeders", and chavs ... whatever) ... for all that, plus "feral youth", *moral (and fiscal) corruption, wet judges, "celebrity culture", "scouse brows" ... and much, much, more ... British Society has no-one to blame but itself!

Meanwhile ... here's the link I was thinking of. And here's another (that is more or less related).

* I hear that "moral neutrality" is the latest idiom. Which just goes to support what I was saying earlier about folk "not wanting to get involved".

Not wishing to turn this thread into a political one, I was born here but I had no choice what so ever on that. Neither did people who were born in other countries. Does that mean they should stay there and suffer? Unfortunately, there are some bad people with lots of power and if they were in this country, we would probably try to leave for a better life if we couldn't change things here.

Just thought I would offer a bit of balance, Jeremy Clarkson style

Anyway, don't Draeger already have drop boxes for their parts in set locations. I guess it already exists, but I think the original link looks to be a great idea but if some undesirable people want to look inside it, it will be fairly easy to open.

First point:- in short yes, "stay and suffer" (but define "suffer")*, just as I do here in my own country.

I am also all for balance. So here's another thought:- at what point do the "asylum seekers" return home? Can we assume the answer to be:- "when things get better"?

Second point:- I am not talking about "drop boxes" (as used by various large companies), but secure arrangements for accepting deliveries at private addresses (when no-one is at home).


A bit like a window (or a back door), you mean?

* Millions of people around the globe suffer every day (children, especially). Should all of them simply make their way to the Promised Land, then?

In years gone by you could leave your front door open. Got to remember that you had nothing worth stealing, now if you had a 'drop box' they would steal that too!
In years gone by I once repaired equipment in pubs, went to one to repair the video jukebox only to find that the TV was missing, stole the previous night when the pub was full.

Scouser! Ha, ha.

Trouble is these days "having nowt worth stealing" doesn't really help ... as the drug-fuelled [censored] would just as likely batter you to death anyway.

Meanwhile Neil, as you must have heard, we're enjoying something of a revival in the business of metal theft at the moment.

Some folk (eg, Daily Mail readers) keep banging on about the need to regulate Scrap Metal Dealers. Well, perhaps that wouldn't be a bad idea ... but I suspect that most of the stuff goes straight into the back of containers, trucks and vans and heads straight off "elsewhere".

Yet another of the benefits we accrue from having Open Borders, I guess.

But back to the "drop box" ... perhaps we'll add to the spec something about wiring it to up the mains, so that it becomes "live" when tampered with (triggered by a trembler, tilt switch, or some such device ... you know, the sort of thing those pin-ball machines in pubs used to have).

It finally came to me It's a company called ByBox and they do these Dropboxes that I had seen in the news.

Nice slogans!

"It's never crowded along the extra mile" ... yes, I can vouch for that one.

Or, as a friend remarked recently:-

"If it wasn't hard, more people would be doing it"!