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Sage
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Is it me? Or have I noticed a definite trend towards what was once considered to be senior positions / duties within the EBME world being advertised a Band or two below Agenda for Change agreed job profiles.
Also the introduction of "Senior Assistant Technical posts" at very low bandings.

Whereas we have experienced (on the whole) the good times when the valuable role we undertake had been recognised (AFC!) and rewarded, current vacant roles are either not being filled, or they are advertised below what I would consider to be a fair and equitable salary.

In some cases, financial constraints (NHS), and in the private sector prudent business skills dictate these changes; I find this trend somewhat disheartening. When trying to attract young, talented, new blood into this employment sector, it will become increasingly difficult to fill these posts with the calibre of employee we need.

Also for those in our field who wish to advance their careers, (I take on board any comments from Geoff, yes mate! some are quite happy as they are) opportunities are somewhat limited, if not non-existent. Remuneration used to be commensurate with increased responsibility.

It would appear that in these difficult times, we may be failing to attract the best in what is a very competitive marketplace.

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Super Hero
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I think it's known as "market forces", Sean. Either that or "we knew it couldn't last for ever"!

Meanwhile, I believe I may have already given the answer (at another thread) to your apparent dilemma:- recruit from overseas (Eastern Europe especially). smile

I don't think I'm being too harsh when I say that (in general) young Brits don't want to work. In short, they have been sold the idea that the world owes them a living (or whatever). All they need is a Degree in "media studies" or "the performing arts", then it's all aboard the Gravy Train!

Thirteen years of socialist BS has led to that sorry state of affairs. Anyone who doubts that need look no further than yesterday's "student activities" in London. frown

"Attract the best"? When have we ever done that? Everyone I know who is of any use is (was) ex-something else or other!

Funded by the British taxpayer, the NHS does not (should not) exist simply to "advance careers" ... it is supposed to be concentrating on caring for the sick, injured and needy, etc., etc.

But lastly, how can you advance further if you're already, shall we say, out in front, at centre left field? whistle


If you don't inspect ... don't expect.
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Sage
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A few points to respond to:

Eastern Europe recruitment may be a solution, but I believe there are enough qualified candidates within the UK, then EU (in that order.

I think you are being too harsh, your rant against students, and young people(in general) is in my opinion unfounded, the vast majority want to take up employ in a well structured and rewarded career role, (in whatever field they choose).

Students have the right to protest against cuts, as indeed anyone else has. I wouldn’t be so broad in my view as to tar them all with the same brush, blame those who high jacked a previously peaceful protest.

We do attract the best in the NHS, as anyone who has sat on an interview panel will tell you Geoff; currently we have an average of 80 applicants for every vacant position.

The NHS exists to provide quality healthcare, you can’t deliver that service without attracting and retaining quality staff, (retention includes being able to fulfill career aspirations).

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Originally Posted By: Sean Fearon

current vacant roles are either not being filled, or they are advertised below what I would consider to be a fair and equitable salary.

In some cases, financial constraints (NHS), and in the private sector prudent business skills dictate these changes.


Wasn't Agenda For Change put in place so that a certain job had a certain pay and thats it??! Financial constraints etc should have no say in it.

Personally I think there should be restrictions on the use of the word "Senior" in a job title too. No Job title should contain the word Senior unless that post has seniority over other employees.

Last edited by Cyberdog; 11/11/10 9:15 AM.

I love deadlines, I like the wooshing sound they make as they fly by.
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Super Hero
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In that case, Sean ... how come NHS biomed departments have so much grief trying to fill vacancies? Many appear to be re-advertising over and over again. frown

Believe it or not, I have sat on NHS interview panels. Sorry Mate, but I wasn't impressed by any of those short-listed (from a list of twenty or so no-hopers).

And (about "the young"), perhaps I've just been unlucky in the students I've come across, then. Notice that I'm saying "student".

Take a close look at the faces of those misbehaving yesterday ... it's them who's "having a laugh"! Once they have tried real work for a while, then they can "demonstrate" if they must (and are not too tired).

@Cyber: as in Senior Sales Assistant in places of renown like Maplin's, Halfords et al then?


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Sage
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Hello Geoff & Cyberdog

Plenty of applicants (wrong skills mix, or lacking relevant experience). We fail to appoint, (and then we re-advertise) because in an ideal world we want staff who can contribute from day one (not after a lengthy and costly training / induction phase).

To attract such experienced staff, you need to provide the appropriate attractive job package

The topic is current vacancies Geoff, (not student bashing) but in the interests of free speech, have your say.

Cyberdog - I agree, Senior ***** Assistant, sounds like a retail post.

Also Agreements under Agenda for Change seem to be going out of the window, just look at some of the posts which advertise salaries structures outside agreed Banding structures.

Watch this space....

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Super Hero
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Yes ... Current Vacancies. Not being filled.

It's Armistice Day. I didn't notice any "students" at the War Memorial I attended just now, Sean. Perhaps they're still in kip, following yesterday's exertions. frown


If you don't inspect ... don't expect.
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Sage
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Good Luck to Them!
I would rather have people attending of their own volition, rather than being forced too.

You may, or may not agree with their viewpoint, they have freedom of choice, that's the whole point Geoff of defending rights and liberties.

Whilst I might not always agree with our imperfect society, I would defend the rights of individuals, whether they be young student's, (or old soldier's).

Can we please return to topic?

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Geoff,
I think it has been established that the rioting/damage was caused by a small group of anarchists who used the otherwise peaceful protest to push their own agenda.

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If you look closely at the vacancy you'll notice that the minimum requirement is 5 GCSE's and for someone just out of school band 3 is pretty good.

What makes it look strange is the Snr, even in Terry Pratchett's book Going Postal Junior Postman Groat had to wait until he was 50 before being considered senior and apparently that came with hat wearing responsibilities.

You would have thought that a requirement to be considered Snr was that the candidate was no longer wet behind the ears.

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