Home Articles Downloads Forum Products Services EBME Expo Contact
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
#77568 27/10/23 5:36 PM
Joined: Oct 2023
Posts: 2
Elle Offline OP
Newbie
OP Offline
Newbie
Joined: Oct 2023
Posts: 2
Hi, I look after the medical devices at a private hospital, we have recently informed the consultants that they need to insure their equipment (they were previously under the impression that their personal indemnity insurance covered medical devices) My question is - can anyone recommend a company that would insure Consultant owned medical devices? Thank you. Elle.


Broken? Me or the device?!?
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,638
Likes: 60
Super Hero
Offline
Super Hero
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,638
Likes: 60
Insured against what? Third-party, fire and theft?

Does the equipment carry the blame in cases of operator "confusion", or general mishap?

How is such equipment maintained, safety checked etc., I wonder?

It is usually considered "good practice" for all equipment - regardless of ownership - in the hospital to come under the maintenance umbrella. Someone has to be responsible - in short, it should be the hospital senior management. In cases of "incidents", it is no good casting around to apportion blame on the grounds of (for instance):- "Oh, but it wasn't our equipment; it belonged to Dr. XYZ".

So I would suggest that the insurer needs to be the same one who underwrites the rest of the equipment in the hospital; hopefully a single premium (or as few as may be appropriate) covering the whole lot.


If you don't inspect ... don't expect.
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,955
Likes: 32
Hero
Offline
Hero
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,955
Likes: 32
The hospital should check the equipment meets UK (MHRA) standards, that it is maintained, and that the consultant actually owns the equipment. (*I raised a concern at a private hospital that a piece of equipment in the storeroom had an nhs hospital asset label on it. It turned out that the consultant had got the nhs hospital to buy the device, then took it down the road to the local private hospital and left it there. He was disciplined by the Trust).
Equipment Insurance could cover theft, but I don't know of any insurance companies that would cover clinical negligence.


Be Proactive and reactive.
Joined: Oct 2023
Posts: 2
Elle Offline OP
Newbie
OP Offline
Newbie
Joined: Oct 2023
Posts: 2
Hi John

I appreciate the reply, we do ask for service reports / conformity documents annually. They are also recorded on an asset list but they are not on the asset management systems. From the hospitals point we need insurance that covers the patients, but I have mentioned that they need to consider theft / damage etc. Naughty consultant I bet the NHS were looking for the device!


Broken? Me or the device?!?
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,638
Likes: 60
Super Hero
Offline
Super Hero
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,638
Likes: 60
Annual bits of paper? Not good enough, in my opinion. Does anyone technical ever get to look (check for condition, at least) at those items of equipment owned (presumably) by "outsiders" (not employees of the hospital)?

What happens about "electrical safety" (testing) at your hospital, I wonder?

You mention "... covers the patients"; what risks are you hoping to insure against there?


If you don't inspect ... don't expect.
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,638
Likes: 60
Super Hero
Offline
Super Hero
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,638
Likes: 60
@John

I wonder if the NHS (owner) even noticed it was missing.

As mentioned before, I have come across many NHS-tagged items at auctions, as well as seeing plenty on eBay (of course).

I once bought an item at auction (on behalf of a charity) that still carried a tag from a place where I had done an agency booking. When I later phoned the lads, they confirmed that the asset number was still on their database ... but, yes (you've guessed it) they hadn't realised it was missing. It belonged in the OPD.

And no, they didn't get it back - it was already on its way to Kashmir, where it probably did much more "good" than it ever did at [redacted]).


If you don't inspect ... don't expect.
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,955
Likes: 32
Hero
Offline
Hero
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,955
Likes: 32
Pretty similar experience Geoff. This particular device been in the private hospital for 4 years (from new - taken there by the consultant) - but logged as 'not found' on the Trusts database. No one had raised it as a concern, because so much equipment is 'not found' on routine ppm rounds. The consultant should have been reported to the police and sacked, but he got a 'slap on the wrist' ... probably because there is such a shortage of experienced consultants in the NHS. The Trust did change their purchasing policy - which at that time allowed consultants to sign off on purchases. All purchases had to be authorised by the medical devices committee after that.


Be Proactive and reactive.
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,638
Likes: 60
Super Hero
Offline
Super Hero
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,638
Likes: 60
Sadly, I'm not surprised in the slightest by that, John. I could comment further (with similar stories, and worse), but I don't want to derail the thread.

Except perhaps to add:- yes, the Medical Devices Committee is the "answer" (every hospital, however large or small, should have one). It should hardly need saying as well (although even these days I hear that the message has not everywhere got through) that they should also have Biomedical Engineering Technicians available.

Databases are all very well (and I have worked with them since the dawns of dBASE). But you still can't beat "hands (and eyes) on". A physical "stock take", tedious as it may seem to some, remains the only valid way to ... er, take stock!


If you don't inspect ... don't expect.
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,955
Likes: 32
Hero
Offline
Hero
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,955
Likes: 32
...A physical "stock take"
I agree Geoff, databases need to be accurate and up to date.


Be Proactive and reactive.
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,638
Likes: 60
Super Hero
Offline
Super Hero
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,638
Likes: 60
Yes; but how is that done? At some places I have seen only "certain" (authorised) folk had data entry/editing access to the database. Maybe they could not trust "junior" staff to make corrections - or maybe they just wanted to retain their magic powers (probably a bit of both).

I have also come across situations where folk insisted that the database was "gospel" (reflected the actual situation) even when it was clearly evident that the kit was "missing" (long-gone in one particular case) or incorrectly listed (manufacturer, location, duplicated ... whatever).

The "best" situation I saw was where a senior biomed divided his time between sitting at the database screen and wandering the "estate" checking, checking ... and, err, checking.

Nowadays, of course, many techs carry hand-held devices - possibly linked via Wi-Fi et al to the master database. Or better yet, to a sub-database that gets reviewed by someone with the remit of checking data before it gets asserted to the master database.

Another idea was where each tech was responsible for their own data; each with their own database. Well, I'll leave you to imagine what could go wrong with that approach ...


If you don't inspect ... don't expect.
1 member likes this: John Sandham
Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  DaveC in Oz, Huw D, RoJo 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 234 guests, and 414 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
lauru2017, Banti, Mlqg_Bkdn, W.S., Joseph28
10,152 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums25
Topics11,026
Posts73,582
Members10,152
Most Online5,980
Jan 29th, 2020
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5