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Posted By: ColeyCod88 Register of Clinical Technologists - 18/01/19 4:10 PM
Hello All,

I was curious whether any other trusts or EBME teams incorporate the RCT (Register of Clinical Technologists) as an essential criteria for B5 and above? I would also like to enquire to the benefit this has to the individual, the department, the trust. The RCT clearly states it is voluntary but it is a mandatory registration for any Technicians B4 and below to achieve promotion to B5.

Opinions?

Many thanks,

Coley
Posted By: Alan M Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 18/01/19 9:12 PM
I am a member of the RCT and have been so for around 10 years. I have colleagues at band 6 and 7 who are members too. However at my trust it is not a requirement at all. More of a personal choice
Posted By: John Sandham Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 28/01/19 12:36 PM
Does this register actually make a difference to our community? Does it make any difference to your chance of getting a job? I remain to be convinced of the benefits...
Posted By: ColeyCod88 Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 14/06/19 10:14 AM
Hi John,

Well in my personal circumstance a B5 post requires an RCT membership, I applied so I would progress my career and my portfolio was rejected because my current banding states I only work to HND/HNC. As a number of people have stated they are becoming very particular, I have slaved away trying to prove that the work I do is that of or equivalent to a B6 biomed but they wouldn't acknowledge any of my 20,000 word portfolio containing substantial evidence due to the job banding description, very frustrating.

I was just curious to see if any other trusts or companies had incorporated the RCT as a pre-requisite for employment or in my case progression, as I like you John do not understand the relevancy or benefit of a membership.
Posted By: Geoff Hannis Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 14/06/19 10:52 AM

Only HNC? Are we saying that a time-served bloke who started off with City & Guilds doesn't get a look-in these days?

Who are these people (the RCT) ... do they consider themselves to be the Gods of Biomed? think

On a positive note, and as I have mentioned on here many times before, I believe that the American examination based Certification schemes (CBET, CCE et al) are the way to go.
Posted By: Chris Watts Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 18/06/19 8:49 PM
The person most likely to get struck off the RCT is probably not the person who would join. So if registration is necessary being voluntary the people it should be safeguarding the public from is not in their remit. Technically their only action is basically censuring and not sanction as it is not essential for employment. (seen some NMC cases and they can be savage)

It does check who is carrying out CPD checks but then again IEng/CEng status does the same, but when has IEng status been an essential requirement?

... perhaps it should be. smile

To my mind, it would make more sense.
Posted By: Steveddie Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 05/07/19 10:34 PM
My own take of the rct, of which I am a member, is that it is a vastly useful measure of a persons professional development in our field. I can promote an individual as far as I can (metaphorically) but could that be just my opinion or bias, within a limited scope of my operational activities, and unfair to the development of an individual and the opportunities that may exist beyond my field of influence? The rct is a specific yet an independent measure/overview assessment of that persons credibility, experience and working practices that is scrutinised and deliberated over. I think it has immense value as an independent assessment of experience, training, personal development AND practice. As it’s a voluntary register we don’t use it as essential for band 6, but I personally, outside of working constraints, think it should be an essential. It’s so good for the individual especially I feel in this field as it is quite specific, more so than other professional registrations that are more generic in my opp. It is also not even a desirable for our band 5 posts, however I do encourage our band 5’s to apply for, with the portfolio of evidence they have amassed in their career as that very self same independent assessment to ensure that we are developing our teams appropriately too.
Posted By: Geoff Hannis Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 06/07/19 12:57 PM

I had to read that post twice ... you're having a laugh, right (I notice your post was written late in the evening)?

Are you suggesting that the "wise ones" at the RCT should now be deciding who gets "promoted"? If we are going down that route - and we want "fairness" - I think it would be better if a National institution had National promotion boards (that is, along the lines of the Armed Forces). smile

How does "promotion" work in the NHS, anyway? I'm assuming that vacancies arise, they get advertised far and wide, then candidates apply ... to be called for interview etc., etc. Of course, there have been cases (or so I have heard) where a "preferred" candidate (generally already in-house) is standing by, but the post still needs to be advertised according to the Rules and then a number of interviews carried out (fair enough, in my view). After all, I hope we have a meritocracy (at least of sorts).

Does anyone ever get promoted "out of the blue" - when still in post - whether such promotion is welcome (by the one being promoted) or not?

And lastly, I wonder where the RCT stands on the "box ticking" elements of employment:- gender equality, ethic diversity, "inclusion", quotas, transparency, "ageism" ... and any other that I may have overlooked?

By the way - in case anyone gains another impression here - my own interests remain firmly in the camp of:- ability to do the job.
Posted By: Chris Watts Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 07/07/19 11:19 AM
Originally Posted by Geoff Hannis
Are you suggesting that the "wise ones" at the RCT should now be deciding who gets "promoted"? If we are going down that route - and we want "fairness" - I think it would be better if a National institution had National promotion boards (that is, along the lines of the Armed Forces). smile

Have you ever seen an RCT representative at a Trust deciding who gets promoted or not, it's just another standard that's out there that can be used to as a criterion for suitability, a bit like asking for CEng/IEng

Originally Posted by Geoff Hannis
How does "promotion" work in the NHS, anyway? I'm assuming that vacancies arise, they get advertised far and wide, then candidates apply ... to be called for interview etc., etc. Of course, there have been cases (or so I have heard) where a "preferred" candidate (generally already in-house) is standing by, but the post still needs to be advertised according to the Rules and then a number of interviews carried out (fair enough, in my view). After all, I hope we have a meritocracy (at least of sorts).

There are two routes either interview for new post or re-banding after taking on extra responsibilities. (reorganisation is a separate issue) There are the National Job Profiles which probably come close to your national promotion boards. (more national job standards boards)

I actually noticed someone who could have been struck off the register shocked although they just cancelled their membership instead boggle
Posted By: Geoff Hannis Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 07/07/19 12:38 PM

"Jumping" before they were "pushed", you mean?

Meanwhile, if an interview panel is swayed into hiring someone because of the brilliance of their RCT portfolio, and that person (now on the team) subsequently bins membership of the RCT - what happens then? Nothing, I suspect. Would the hiring organisation (Trust) even be made aware of this turn of events?

Meanwhile, maybe the runner-up at interview may have a grievance (but there again, he/she would probably not even know why the other candidate was hired in the first place). Just a (random) thought. But that's what I mean by (lack of) transparency. smile

Originally Posted by Chris Watts

Have you ever seen an RCT representative at a Trust deciding who gets promoted or not ...


Thankfully not ... but my remarks were in response to Steveddie's seemingly enthusiastic endorsement of what the RCT can "bring to the table".
Posted By: Chris Watts Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 07/07/19 2:39 PM
An interview panel would not see the candidates RCT portfolio but you'd expect some of what's included to also be in their application or CV.

The spec for a successful candidate would have essential and desirable characteristics of which being on the RCT would be one entry. You'd expect the successful candidate to meet all the essential characteristics and then some of the desirable one. If they asked for RCT registration and then gave the post to someone who didn't have it that candidate might have a grievance but it's probable that all candidates did not fully meet the spec. (you'd have to weigh manufactures training over RCT)

Interviews are gateways to a job so what you're a member of just depends at interview. If you're kicked off the register an HR department would treat any correspondence the same as a complaint of theft from WHSmiths involving an individual in work uniform to that of a report of racism from Hope not hate.

Ah ... so they would just ignore it, then? think
Posted By: Chris Watts Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 07/07/19 8:03 PM
Originally Posted by Geoff Hannis

Ah ... so they would just ignore it, then? think

Ignore which? Interview panel would just see that someone managed to get on the register.

If you're talking about binning membership that an interesting question. As well as asking for RCT, medical electronics jobs get around AFC matching by saying you have a qualification and specialist manufacturer training which is equivalent to the next qualification. Now if someone doesn't go on another training course for the next number of years do they get pulled up for no longer matching the job spec? The criteria are only checked at interview, only a problem if they apply for another post.

"Ignore which?" ... I was referring to the last paragraph of your post. whistle

As for the rest - maybe Douglas Bader got it about right when he said:- "Rules are for the obedience of fools, and the guidance of wise men".
Posted By: Chris Watts Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 09/07/19 5:17 PM
Depending on what was reported they'd come down on you like a ton of bricks, there's bring the Trust into disrepute, no disclosing criminal records and the favourite not living the Trust values. Not completing your CPD, on the other hand, some would probably tell them where to go.

Does the Trust make it clear to everyone what the values to be "lived" actually are?

And ... if these values change (for instance, when a new CEO takes over, or a new "branding" make-over, or "mission statement", is imposed), do the faithful get the option to withdraw with honour? think

If I remember rightly, contracts - and I'm assuming that NHS staff are hired on some sort of contractual basis - can be breached (intentionally or otherwise) by either party; that is, it isn't (or shouldn't be allowed to be) a one-sided situation.
Posted By: Chris Watts Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 09/07/19 9:14 PM
It's usually a interview question, what are the Trust values?

It is like a mission statements. If the next door Trust actually merges with our it will loose it's "Pride" and start having to embrace change. Don't know if that a metaphor for the take over wink

I can think of many metaphors that may apply ... but perhaps I had better leave it there. whistle

I believe that all over-sized public sector organisations end up existing for the benefit of their employees rather than for the public they are supposed to be serving. All organisations go like this in the end (and that's why they need breaking up into smaller units from time to time). I hear that NASA has gone the same way (so much so that they'll never get to Mars).
Posted By: Natalie1 Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 26/11/19 8:15 PM
Would the RCT route not be good for engineers who have entered the field / trust but with out previous medical engineering skills but with other skills in another sector !
Posted By: Geoff Hannis Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 27/11/19 12:17 AM

There's probably no harm in such a person joining the RCT (and it may be a "requirement" anyway) ... but I can't imagine how you would learn anything* by doing so.

In my experience, you learn "medical engineering skills" - almost every day - by actually doing the job!

Wouldn't you agree? think

* Anything useful, practical or technical, that is.
Posted By: Neil Porter Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 29/11/19 11:50 PM
I would hate to have had my career path determined by a voluntary body, especially one that is not recognised either by the government or any other official body within or outside of the UK

... not voluntary. frown
Posted By: Neil Porter Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 30/11/19 11:31 PM
By who's authority?
Posted By: Steveddie Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 01/12/19 11:49 AM
I believe that the RCT and achievement of registration for a person is a good feedback measure for any EBME/Clinical Engineering department providing training for individuals as they progress through their career. With their successful registration, we have some external assurance for ourselves that we have provided for them an objective, recognised and balanced spectrum of experiences and knowledge. Which can only benefit themselves in future their career and the department going forward.

We have it as a desirable quality though not essential (as it is voluntary); I actively encourage all of our technicians to develop a portfolio of evidence from day 1, somewhat aligned to the RCT equivalence route criteria, to support their eventual RCT applications and evidence experience and competence. Older hands are a little less on board with the evidence gathering for sure but it is still encouraged and annually reviewed.

What's wrong with the "evidence" of hundreds of jobs (and maybe thousands of PMs) successfully completed over the period (year-to-date, or whatever)? think

Originally Posted by Neil Porter

By who's authority?


... the bullies in the playground. frown

PS: whose
Posted By: Darkmarker Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 03/01/20 3:32 PM
I was a member of the RCT, but left as the fee kept going up with no noticible benifits.

As someone who has interviewed many times, I couldn't care less about if someone is on the register. It makes no difference to them being a competent technician, same goes for having a degree, having done the job for umpteen years etc... (some of the best i ever employed were ex-BT engineers) When you interview you look for the best candidate based on what you are looking for and setup the interviews to achieve this aim.

I was chatting with a couple of Openreach blokes* recently ... they reckoned that the majority of their colleagues were ex-Armed Forces. smile

* Both were ex-Royal Signals.
Posted By: leonius Re: Register of Clinical Technologists - 17/04/20 8:07 AM
I felt it was going no where, and without true meaning. So i dropped it off even the desirable creteria for the whole team. I really wanted it to evolve into something useful but it never did.
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