EBME Forums Forums Management Training Overseas cousins technical training...

Good day to you all, could any EBME website overseas visitors explain how they themselves became involved in the repair and maintenance of medical devices? I am aware of the structure in Aus/NZ, US, Germany and UK (what structure...), but what about other countries and continents? Is there any formal structure in place? Military and Civilian.

Post academic study HNC/Degree, must you attend some form of generic and or specific technical training prior to working on medical devices? Is there some form of licensing/certification process etc?

I am currently writing an article for a Military engineering magazine on this very subject, I would be grateful for your views

I know I am not really classed as an "overseas visitor" for the purpose of your inquiry Rob, but since you have not received any replies from those you are hoping will and, if it is not too late either, I will add the little ‘negativity’ I know. As to my personal background, I have always had an underlying interest in this area in question. In fact, my very first job after my apprenticeship, years ago when I first started to be very interested in the medical field (and full of enthusiasm and idealism) was to work in Africa for the government hospitals of Tanzania. Since then I had always had my eyes open for adverts wanting ‘us techs’. to go and set up and work in workshops in other parts of the world and, in particular, the Developing World but nothing that paid more than a ‘survival’ wage seemed to have been advertised (whenever I looked out for work in this direction). For me the only thing that came up was to set up workshops here in the rich oil-world. (No shortage of techs to help where the money is easily come-by!)

Anyway, over the years I have travelled extensively, and worked in developing (and developed) countries in Africa, Central and South America and have always tried to casually evaluate the set up in these countries I have visited. I go and visit the main hospitals and find the maintenance departments or, as in most cases, seek out the poorly paid tech in his basement box-room or under the stairs! doing his one-man-team effort to keep the hospital’s basic electronics going. The overall view I have for these areas is that quite frankly, there is not much happening at all as we know it i.e. no established central (government) schemes set up. I guess this is understandable as the overall costs for country-wide workshops, particularly in countries that do not have a sustainable economy such as is needed to keep the likes of a health service going, must be enormous. Aid programmes such as the British Volunteer Services and GTZ in Germany have done a lot to help establish BME programmes, train techs. and, to some extent, help fund them, but poor local management and high levels of local corruption that is often rife in these areas, has caused such programmes to fail in the long term often, and put off financial aid from major Aid sources world-wide.

So what is available from the training aspect, well some developing countries have the luxury of technical training in basic electricity and electronics through their technical colleges. But I have not seen, in my limited travels, courses for BME training (unless carried out by programmes such as GTZ). The majority of hospitals are private and for them it would probably not be seen as cost-effective anyway to have techs at high salaries. They tend to specialize in one or two medical areas only (Cardiac, Ophthamic etc.) for those that can afford to pay. They have the money to spend but prefer to spend only when the breakdown occurs (in the hopes that it will be more expensive in the short-term but not long-term). There are always, of course, one or two government hospitals covering most of the needed Specialties, but these can vary from well equipped to very basic in many cases, and generally only exist in the capital city. They do of course have an amount of medical equipment to maintain but this is done by the agents in the main cities who supply the equipment in the first place. It would be on a breakdown-only basis or under contractual agreement. The modern big systems such as X-Ray, CT, Radiotherapy etc would be done by contract of course with ‘the big boys’ (Philips, Siemans,GE etc.). However, basic X-Ray units I found were often repaired by the hospital ‘sparki’. Therefore it is not a practical proposition for the government colleges to run training courses where really there is no demand in student quantity in the longer term. Coupled to that, there has always been the problem that where a person has been lucky enough to be trained by the government (and at the government’s expense) or sponsored by overseas aid, the chances are that he/she will opt for the better job conditions and the higher salaries offered by the private sector or the equipment agencies themselves. The government (or overseas sponsor) will then be left high and dry, as on many occasions in the past the trained tech. has left, for example, the up-country hospitals where they perhaps originally came from or were seconded to, for the capital city.

Sorry this is not much help but it is the reality in many areas where one would have expected (and hoped to find) an organized ‘Western-style?’ system in place.

wow here they just buy the qualification and talk crap...
Maybe the same situation in Saudi?
Hmmmmmm

Na Paul. they just pay "Qualified" Westerners to do it. Oh and provide them with unlimited Filis.

Nick,

Enjoyed very much your piece, which I have just read for the first time. It is “spot-on”, in fact. And I notice that the thread went dead after that! Maybe some of our brothers working in the NHS would benefit from a spell “overseas” – we might end up with a more lively forum then, eh?

Meanwhile, how are things with you out there? For myself, I doubt the wisdom of returning now.

Thanks Geoff, I agree with you. It will not be the “right time” to be contemplating a job in the Muslim world here for some time thanks to the unilateral antics of the Bush and Blair team. Those of us long-termers stay at our own peril keeping a low profile and trying to keep a wary eye out for the unexpected. Briefly, it would appear that the main thrust here in Saudi now is to destabilize the government and cause change through getting at high-level local personnel and at expats with business interests here. What all this has done is to advance Saudization at a greater pace in our area of work such that finding jobs may be more difficult due to the positions being vacated quickly by the returning Western expats after each incident and filled directly with Saudis who have to be given jobs. Whether this situation will be the end of the "likes of us' out here, only time will tell. Money is 'seemingly' scarce and workforces are more and more coming from places like South Africa, the Philippines and Bangladesh - the cheaper option. Forget the “big bucks” (and the quality of service) here in the medical field (government sector). There never were any 'big ones' in comparison with home (UK) or the private sector here, and if the salaries at my hospital are a guide for the future, you will definitely end up (in Saudi) with less now (gross) and in the future (net) than in the Uk for the same grade, if you live to spend it that is! Follow your 'gut feeling' and stay safe and away!

Hi Nick, What are your thoughts on Abu Dhabi ?? as I understand Shaikh Khalifa Medical Center are looking for Biomeds. I understand the contract is run by a Canadian Company ( possibly Helen Ziegler ) Keep the Tan topped Up !! Tony.

Hello Tony, as for the Arab Emirate areas, I have no contacts there nor experience in that particular area, or hospital you mention, of Abu Dhabi. I would guess that this is not an area to be worried about for working in at present. The neighbour, Dubai, is however, the biggest Western-styled multi-cultural (as opposed to Saudis one "fundamentalist' culture) capitalist center in the region and could well become an easy target for those out to "topple' capitalism. But again, there has been absolutely no adverse move in that direction (as yet?).

Ahem

Nick, my fellow sand-dweller, as much as Louis, amongst other ex-pats working here in the Kingdom, have applauded you in the past, and will continue to applaud your outstanding posting, I feel this time you speak for your establishment, maybe even your current city. Your description of current issue’s is accurate, but as regards pay we are somewhat bemused. Fair enough, if you are paid in Riyals then blame the American Dollar Vs. the UKP. Do you not recieve all the freebies i.e. Quality Housing, etc. that other co-functionals enjoy?

The exchange rate may improve, it may not. Also my South African Colleagues receive western rate with a western grade. :p they are also having an exchange rate nightmare.

Nick, the majority of our staff are BMET1 and with the tax-free / accommodation / transport etc. I still reckon my pay (what in my gluteus's packet at the end of each month) equival's that of an MTO 4/3 if not even a 5. after tax


Anyway, keep yer head down and maybe one day meet in the afore mentioned Dubai for a Guinness or three

P.S. if you ask me Saudi's no worse than the GRAFTON on a Saturday night