EBME Forums Forums Maintenance Technical Assistance 62353:2008 - Medical electrical equipment.

I don't applaud the comments that the Experts made ... mainly due to the fact that I have never seen them. What I applaud is that they had the balls to make them in the first place!

Can I assume that you've already read through all the other threads on this forum concerning 62353? All the arguments are there.

As I've already said, I'm not against any standard per se. When working as a contractor, I've always been obliged to follow whichever one the client preferred. I understand what 62353 is saying, and yes, I have no problem in following it, but I just don't see it as the "next great thing", that's all. As you quite rightly say, electrical safety testing is not rocket science, and I see 62353 being simply part of a progression, and not much more than what well-organized techs have been doing for years anyway.

But you couldn't be more wrong about me not liking it when others express their opinions. I like to encourage "debate" on this forum. To my mind, everyone, even the dull and the ignorant (should we ever hear from such people), have a right to be heard. But that doesn't mean that no rebuttal will be forthcoming if such is called for!

Yes, I'm willing to learn. But I like to think that I've already mastered Ohm's Law!

I'm not against anyone in this forum.
Yes, it is common sense isn't it! I share your feeling.

Well said! Let matter takes it path! Let people decide on their choices.

Good to be humble, mate! Obviously your task gets going without people questioning you too much!

Well, now I have seen them, and it seems that the UK Experts Committee voted against the approval of 62353 as a European Standard. Part of the objection was that the draft standard (as it then was) was based on testing practice used in continental Europe, and contained test configurations which deviated from those established in IEC 60601-1. Despite this the BSI, as a member of CENELEC, was still obliged to publish EN 62353 as a British Standard. So now we have a British Standard (imposed upon us) with which our own appointed experts are not entirely happy. To my mind this is yet another example of traditional British practice being overruled by European bureaucrats. I rest my case.

Wonky Bananas etc. Its all a bit silly now!

Ed

Don't worry, the next revision of the Standard will require the UK to change over to the Schuko plug, I should imagine.

Actually I find the "Quality" Schuko in a sunken socket is a better design! As you know mate, we got the lot out here! I appreciate that "other" configurations can fit a Schuko system but how many times have you seen hair-dryer wires shoved straight in a UK spec socket!

Eddie

Since we're on the topic of mains plugs, and yes, I reckon I've met (and endured) every type imaginable, I will come out and declare that (in my humble, but experienced, opinion) the British "13 Amp" type remains the best, all things considered.

A close runner up would have to be the US "Hospital Grade" type, beaten into second place only by the fact that it "sticks out" a bit from the wall socket outlet, and therefore tends to sag (and also be susceptible to being knocked into by passing trolleys etc.).

Not only is the British type polarized (a very important point, in my view), it is also fused (important point No.2) and the cable hangs down in an elegant swoop! The Schuko has none of these pleasing features!

And, please, let's not hear any nonsense about any so-called "break-away" feature. Mains electrical connections are not meant to be yanked!

"God save the queen"

Ed

For more on mains plugs of the world, see here.

Just answer this simple question Eddie ... what nationality was James Clerk Maxwell? QED.

PS: for balance, perhaps I should note that Georg Ohm was born in Erlangen, home of Siemens x-ray equipment!

But I would suggest that Maxwell was, without doubt, a genius guy, right up there with Einstein and Newton. Pity, then, that he's no longer available to sit on IEC Expert Committees! I wonder what he would have thought of IEC 60906 (what do we all think of it)? Even they don't seem too impressed!

And in case anyone out there is getting a bit confused (?) ... no, I'm not saying that Maxwell invented the BS-1363 mains plug. And neither am I saying that he of the famous Law invented the dreaded Schutzkontakt (which means, by the way, "earthed contact")! For that we must thank Herr Albert Büttner back in 1926.

HI Geoff,

As a borne mainlander, I did think the UK plug was a bit of a space ship compared to the schuko socket, But... must admit; Life would be so much easier and better if all of EU moved over to the UK 13 amp socket. How good is polarised mains and having the fuse accessible? Not to mention the protection against shock by using the inserting of protective earth. None of that exists in "schuko" land.

Coming back to your comments on the UK committee who voted against IEC 62353, I'm on that (miror)committee too and must say, the comments came from 1 or 2 individuals who were not open to appreciating the similarities between IEC 62353 and IEC 60601. Whilst they were invited to participate, they did not, and claimed that as being part of the reason to voted against (mmmmm?) Therefore, I do not think the arguments against the IEC 62353 were very strong and I am (and others too) willing to debate the UK comments.

I am willing to organise an informative debate / seminar on natural ground with for and against "experts" so we can decide ourselves what this standard is about and whether it actually provides benefits or not. As many people do consider this forum as an educational tool we must feed information based on facts.

I invite all experts to cast their votes on a life forum.