EBME Forums Forums Management Professional Issues Nursing Issues Key Trainers

Ok so you get the company in to do Train the trainer sessions , and then those staff go away and train other staff on medical devices. Why can't those people train others to be trainers? Playing devils advocate there, but it is a question that arises time and time again, and yet there seems to be little evidence to back up what seems a universal commitment to medical companies ONLY doing the train the trainer sessions!

Anyone know of any guidelines/policies etc that stipulate this is a requirement? I have been asked this question by numerous emerging equipment libraries and thought it was about time I asked for the wisdom of the ebme club here!

Maybe it's someting to do with Chinese Wispers (2 and 6, we're going to a dance).
The danger is that the key messages will be diluted, re-interpreted or forgotten and after the fourth or fifth "train the trainer" session the training will have changed from the original emphasis.
It is important that the the training is carried out by the people who received the original training from the company.

If the trainers trained new trainers ... then how would the training providers (companies) continue to make their money?

Also, human nature being what it (often) is, have you never come across sad people who are simply, shall we say, unwilling to share their knowledge? They fail to understand that when you share knowledge, you don't lose it. But, there again, knowledge is power (or so they say)!

A Freudian Slip, perhaps? Or just a clever way of reinforcing the point?

"Send three and fourpence, we're going to a dance"!

Meanwhile, surely the "key points" would be simple, dare I say bulleted headings?

Monkey see, monkey do, I would have thought!


How come, then, that the army manages better than most with the time-honoured system whereby everyone trains everyone else? It is a given that any guy who has been away "on the course" trains the rest of the bods (if need be) when he comes back to the unit. In the army almost everybody is an instructor in something or other ... even if it's "only" drill!

The difference Geoff is that in the Army you are taught repetitive tasks that do not involve any analysis or reasoning. Whereas, hopefully, medical staff using equipment after appropriate training are going to think about why and how they are using it.

Can I take it, then, that you have never served yourself?


Sounds a lot like mainstream nursing to me! Oh sorry, I forgot, they've all got degrees now.

QUOTE Kawasaki:"in the Army you are taught repetitive tasks that do not involve any analysis or reasoning. Whereas, hopefully, medical staff using equipment after appropriate training are going to think about why and how they are using it."

We were also exempt from Income Tax!!

Funny how many of these ex forces "nodding donkeys's" are now employed in ebme!
Topper

Are you a "nodding donkey", then, Topper ... seeing that you've just made the same post five times?

It's a long time ago now (for me), but I think the "exempt from income tax" thing is a myth. In fact, I seem to recall it being a bone of contention that taxes were paid to the UK regardless of where we happened to be in the world.

There are so many ex-forces blokes in biomed, because (essentially) we built biomed! There were very few other trained techs available back then. If you came across an indigenous NHS type, chances are he would have been a "boffin" from Medical Physics! Yet I still meet non-ex-forces techs who haven't grasped the concept of BER (and all the rest)!

And speaking for myself (and I would say, most of my pals from that era), I was never a "nodding donkey", believe me! Not an ass ... more like kick-ass, in fact. Sounds like I need to make some visits!

Good grief I ask for some input and get a tirade about the army!!!

Also Geoff with the utmost respect, I am a nurse with a degree, and I dont feel that I am that useless - I hope not anyway. I do not feel that my degree represents all of my effort, time and experience as a professional.There are many people with qualifications who took nurse training later in life and do in fact have something to offer besides a piece of paper. Being embroiled in academia and not seeing the real picture is something I do not support; it should be a mix of learnt skills plus hard work & experience. There are some ineffective nurses just as there are some poor engineers, and generalising is insulting.

There had my wee rant!

Now I am digressing -back to question I posed- please?

I am an engineering technician without a degree. And I've already responded to your original question!

What sort of training are you talking about? User training on medical equipment, by nurses and other clinical users?

You were asking about policies and guidelines. Why should anyone need such as these? Why not just get on with the task that needs to be done, that is self-evident, and right before your eyes. You know, the "can-do" approach to getting things done (or, if you like, the army way)!

Yes, I agree, generalising can be insulting. I hope that if anyone is nodding, that they are nodding wisely!