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#64018 28/02/13 7:06 PM
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I'm looking at using NFC tags to identify equipment as an alternative to RFID. Anybody else using NFC?
My objective is to label Defib spoons. At the moment we have difficulty in finding spoons that are due for service because our decontamination people are not very good at labelling the bags. I've decided to try out NFC to scan the bags and read what's inside. I used a(n) USB NFC reader to write data to the tags which was sucessful. The tags I chose were designed for laundry use which are also suitable for heat sterilisation (130C for 500hrs & 140C for 100hrs).
I am now looking for a portable solution where I can take a small device with me to scan the bags in Theatres. Any ideas?
One solution I'm considering is developing a reader using the Arduino board, anyone experienced with this?

Last edited by biomedbill; 28/02/13 7:08 PM. Reason: typo
biomedbill #64020 28/02/13 7:33 PM
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NFC: Near Field Communication. Sounds like an interesting project, Bill. Do tell us more.

Meanwhile, I (also) have been wondering about Arduino* (but, in my case, have yet to splash out in both money and time). Has anyone else on here had a go yet? think

I guess you're already aware that there's usually a load of stuff like this (hand-held doodads, readers, scanners, and all the rest) on eBay, Bill - especially if you don't mind waiting a few days for stuff to arrive from China. But yet again, that's another question of time (mainly) and money (often just "pocket money", happily) for the Keen Experimenter! smile

But 130 °C for three weeks? Good job my pasties don't take that long (otherwise I'd starve)!

* Obviously I'm not the only one who loves stuff like that.

biomedbill #64028 28/02/13 10:50 PM
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Here you are, Bill. Let us know how you get on. smile

However, having spent a few minutes looking into this stuff, it seems to me that using a Smartphone (app) is the way it's done.

I'm also wondering if that "nearly touching" technology (about six inches, and a lot closer than "Bluetooth") is used in medical kit yet. I could imagine it being used to pass drug data between TCI pumps, for example - or "teach and learn" re-configuration of pumps, and good stuff like that. Heck, it looks like we need to update the spec* on the GLIB!

Meanwhile:- another day, another forum.

* It's looking like 13.56 MHz is the magic number for NFC.

biomedbill #64032 01/03/13 1:36 AM
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Here is another source of info, Bill. smile


If you don't inspect ... don't expect.
biomedbill #64035 01/03/13 12:38 PM
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There's a whole world of stuff out there. libnfc & open nfc are two established development sites. Unfortunately my programming skills have lapsed and am having to start from scratch.
As for the Arduino I anticipated connecting a LCD display & I2C NFC "shield" to make a basic reader.
I could just order a NFC enabled smartphone or tablet PC but where's the fun in that?

Looking to the future a NFC enabled tablet could become the mobile office for biomeds. If all the equipment is tagged then we could use the tablet to call up the equipment records, fill in job sheets whilst off site & view manuals. I'm sure there are many other applications we couls use tablets for to make life easier.

biomedbill #64036 01/03/13 1:46 PM
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Yes Bill, if I was starting up a new department, I guess I would go for Tablets. Plus a hand-held device of some kind in the pocket of every biomed, of course (an Android device, or Smartphone perhaps). Plus as much small test kit as my dream budget allowed (and all talking to each other, naturally). Oh, OK ... dream on. whistle

The trouble is, if you're not careful, what is the latest "state of the art" right now can easily become a "laughing stock" in what - five, or ten, years time. frown

But keep an eye on what Neil is doing out in Jeddah (which sounds pretty much the way to go, from what he says). Rigel test kit synched with the "database", .pdf's on the Tablets, Wi-Fi back to the workshop (I think), and good stuff like that.

Fun? Yes, indeed. Just as long as you're not under too much pressure to have a "solution" ASAP. I know myself (only too well, in fact) how projects that start with good intentions [and boundless enthusiasm] can sometimes remain on the "drawing board" many years later. So - go for it, Bill!

But a couple of questions, if I may:- which type of tags do you use, and how to you mark them? think

biomedbill #64038 01/03/13 2:56 PM
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I'll have a word with Neil, we have just had Wi-Fi installed throughout our trust.

As for state of the art, the trick is to weigh up the best time to jump in. The costs of NFC devices are falling and possibly in a couple of years they will be ten a penny or they could be obsolete. There is a bit of resistance against NFC in the UK. Many people are arguing that NFC doesn't bring anything unique to the table, most of the apps you can think of are already catered for using existing tech, Bluetooth, QR codes etc.

As for the tags, for I'm trialling NXP Mifare 1K laundry tags. They are about 30mm in diameter with a 4mm hole in the middle. There is no need to mark them as the spoons have their serial number etched onto the connector. I have also identified high temperature cable ties, the standared variety are only rated upto 85C.

If we do decide to expand the use of these tags, there are a massive range to choose from, including printable ones.

biomedbill #64039 01/03/13 3:21 PM
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Originally Posted By: biomedbill

Many people are arguing that NFC doesn't bring anything unique to the table* ...


Then they're wrong, because (due to the short range involved - "near touch", or 5 cm or less), NFC does not have the security concerns that other technologies (Bluetooth et al) need to consider.

And, anyway, why does it have to be "unique" (or special)? What's wrong with:- proven, adaptable, versatile, and er, cheap?

NFC also has the nifty feature of being able to power the tag (sticker, card) from the RF emitted by the Reader, without need for an external source of power. "Sipping power":- I like it.

You can also get NFC tags to do clever things like triggering hardware events ... the possibilities are endless (outside of biomed, at least)!

But regarding your other point(s) about "when, and how" etc. Yes - it's called Engineering (even when we are in fact "only" merely humble Technicians). whistle

Carpe Diem - and He Who Hesitates is Lost! Tally (tag) Ho! smile

* Nice bit of "management speak" there, Bill, by the way.

biomedbill #64274 05/04/13 4:59 PM
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Any news for us on this one, Bill?

I only ask as, having been in the library* earlier today, I learned that they use UPM Raflatac "RaceTrack" tags. Stuck inside the back cover of every book, that is.

Needless to say, the process of borrowing and returning books is much simplified (automated) in this way.

I was very impressed with those tags (labels, whatever). They are no thicker than a traditional "asset tag" sticker, and indeed carry written information on them as well (of course). Straight away I recognised the "possibilities" there. If I were to be commissioning another biomed project now (an unlikely scenario, I'll admit), I think I would use these - or something like them - for the equipment stickers.

Not sure yet about the "spec":- what the possibilities are regarding reading from (and writing to) them, for example (as in:- how's it done?) - but it looks like the "RaceTrack" label can take 1 k or so of data (see this .pdf).

More research required (as the woman in the library wasn't able to answer all my questions, patient soul that she was [and is])! smile

* You know, places in town, run by the Local Authority, where you can borrow books - rather than shared equipment stores in hospitals.

biomedbill #64276 05/04/13 6:17 PM
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Hi Geoff,

I've managed to borrow a(n) NFC enabled mobile phone from a compamy called Toughshield. I seems to have all the functionality that I am looking for but I'm not too sure about their software. The demo version will read the tags ok but I can't compose my own messages to write to the tags. I am waiting to hear back from the company to discuss the product. The programme is a fairly basic Java app so I guess anyone who is literate in Java would be able to write a better programme.
There are a lot of Android apps out there and more & more phones are NFC enabled. Unfortunately this phone is not very smart, but for £70 it's not bad.

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