EBME Forums Forums Maintenance Technical Assistance costing /charging of equipment use

Moira,
Since when has the NHS been free,majority of people in the uk pay tax this is what funds the service.

Get it right please a free service is where NO PAYMENT IS MADE AT ALL TAX OR OTHERWISE.

Or are you suggesting that tax payers should now pay twice?

... like they do when buying ex-NHS equipment at auction, you mean?

Moira did actually say that it was paid for by taxes, and is right to point out the differences in the wealth of the two countries. I do think that charging for individual uses of equipment would be ridiculously burocratic though.

I can see that I need to spell the thing out:- that's exactly what government officials in some parts of the world want. The more "red tape", the greater the opportunity for "dash" (tea-money, back-handers, call it what you may)!

Geoff, you seem determined to offend as many people as possible today.

And Suzuki - Moira did mention that the NHS is funded by taxes...

Mtalam's original post was a simple enquiry. You might not agree with the local politics of Kenya, but the person who posted has to live with it, you don't. Nobody is a better expert than Mtalam on the healthcare system in East Africa. Beating up on him/her does not help.

Yes, it would be wonderful if everybody had access to whatever medical care they need, as we are lucky enough to do. The straight facts are that it is impossible even to dream of that in Kenya, given that the entire parliament apart from one MP is part of the government, after a coalition government was created in such a way that is without an effective opposition party *. (In effect, imagine all of the three main parties in the UK being tied in a vote, and having to form one big coalition - leaving one UKIP MP to form the opposition!) Corruption is rife.

Moira, too, has been flamed unfairly. Her reply was the most pragmatic and fair answer possible, given the circumstances.

Mtalam has pointed out that there is a benevolence in the system, in that those who cannot pay for treatment are given the chance to be remitted of their debt by a committee who assess their case. It's not brilliant, but it has to be better than nothing...

Kenya is in a terrible state, and we can only do our best to support Mtalam and anyone else there, by being polite, and offering fair advice when they ask for it instead of soapbox judgement. Sending redundant equipment is very difficult these days, but if you can that would be great too. As you say, money would not make it to your intended target.

* That was in the Independent only today. Read the article - it is extremely sad.

We all have to live with it. We're living in a "Global Village", a "Globalized World" (how could it be otherwise?) ... everyone is our Brother or our Sister. Or do "Independent" readers just pay lip service to such noble notions, and then simply "look the other way"?


Well, you got that bit right! Frankly, I don't care whose precious sensibilities are "upset", as long as a lending hand is given to those in need.


Oh, and what makes you say that, I wonder? As I've just hinted at elsewhere, us tax-payers have paid for it all once, so how come we don't get a say about how it's disposed of when the time comes?

No, I'm not a newspaper reader. I simply don't have the time to waste reading what the "chattering classes" are gibbering on about today, or any other day (but let me guess ... Jacko wasn't a paedo after all ... it was all about money ... oh, what a surprise). I "make do" with the news feeds available on the web. Actually, it's better that way, as you can get (shall we say), a more balanced, and I dare say less emotional, point of view.

"Lead, follow ... or get out of the way"!

That was exactly my point - you were upsetting the people on the website who have absolutely nothing to do with the problems in the government. Should I blame you personally for the policies of Gordon Brown? No, it is unreasonable. So it is equally unreasonable to pick on Mtalam. (Unless you have proof positive that Mtalam is a Kenyan government minister - but s/he sounds more like a local administrator, perhaps the equivalent of someone working in Supplies dept of a UK NHS Trust.)

As to donating equipment abroad... It's a can of worms, but it seems that more and more trusts want to ensure that even when they have stopped using equipment, they recoup any remaining value in them. Hence auctions, and therefore more difficulty in getting working equipment out to the Third World.

Further, several people on these forums and elsewhere seem to think that there is a legal minefield to donating or selling equipment on. It seems that some fear the buyer/receiver coming back six months later demanding reparations if the equpiment fails, claiming that the seller/donator has legal liability of some kind.

I thought that this should be easily sorted out with a sensibly worded handover document, acquitting the seller/donator of the equipment in a sort of "sold as seen" way but perhaps with some extras, such as previous service information thrown in. However, I'm sure that with the way legalities work out, it would take a lot of work.

Perhaps if you read the more intelligent paper,s then you might see more important information, like that about the current politics in Kenya. Emotions aren't a negative thing - they are what makes people human and humane, which is what you demanded of someone earlier in the thread.

I think it would be better to let our Kenyan friend speak for himself.

There is no problem in shipping good used equipment out to East Africa. I know people who do it all the time.

The real problem is (as you have alluded to) the lack of will by the wallies (jobsworths, or whatever else name they deserve) who seem to be endemic in the UK's National Health Service.

Here's another good old saying:-

"Where there's a will, there's a way"!

Responding to your afternote:- I leave politics to the politicians (they make such a good job of it, after all). My business is simply the tech support of equipment, with emphasis on those in need in the so-called "Majority World". I believe I have all the information I require, thank you very much. But if I miss anything really important, I'm sure someone will come on here and put me straight!

Yes, and it was honestly, and reasonably thoroughly, answered!

Next case, please!

oooh that was too much than what I had asked for.Just to respond to afew of the replies
1.Moira suggested that we charge more on an equipment and the extra be used to cater for the poor.Thats what happens in our private wings where we do charge more and the so called prifits is channeled to the general wings that caters for the have nots.
2.Webbie and Suzuki talked of donations.....that is really what helps us.Recently we completed the construction of a 160 bed delivery hospital funded by the donors and also received 3 containers full of used medical equipment.All but a few of these equipment worked but the challege is that majority didnt have both the users and technical manuals hence the challenge that we are having.We did not receive some spare or replacement parts of these equipment and we are faced with big problems when carring out preventive maintemence.
3.Clare seams to know abit of our politics we are not only having one opposion memeber of paliament but our MPs are most highly paid that those of Westminister you can imagine

All in all I have gotten something I can continue to brain storm over.
thanks