EBME Forums Forums Maintenance Technical Assistance Evaluation on Mindray Products

Hello Everyone,

I would like to solicit your opinions a bout any Mindray products. Any opinion or evaluation based on use will do.

Thank You Very Much


Yours Truly

Charles

They are made in China.

What else do you need to know?

Actually Geoff, the quality and options (specifications) are improving all the time, from a couple of years ago they were only offering patient monitors and ultrasound machines. Now they offer full turnkey projects, and all their own equipment.

Thanks Geoff,
I need to know if anyone have an idea regarding the quality of product, ease of use, durability and anything...

@ Neil, yes, they have now a wide variety of products, they are already offering here in the Philippines a total solutions for ICU patient monitoring and total solutions for Operating Room.

@ Geoff,the outlet for Asia pacific is based in china.

Yes guys ... I'm well aware that Chinese products are conquering the world.

Just like everyone else, best grab them whilst you can still afford them. One day those Chinese workers will be asserting themselves (as workers always do, eventually).

Nothing lasts forever (not even my old Toyota). Apple is now Number 1 (on the back of Chinese labour and, arguably, American innovation). Microsoft has become "yesterday's news" (how many Chinese programmers are there?). British "manufacturers" (bit of a misnomer there, I'm sad to say) rebadge kit made in Shenzhen. That's the way the world is these days. Just about the only market that the UK is still a player in is - yes, you've guessed it - defence (meaning "offence", of course). We're still pretty good at making guns, bullets, and all the rest.

Meanwhile, I doubt that we'll be seeing the likes of Foxconn* setting up in Western Europe any time soon.

@Charles: if you already know all these things ... why (what) are you asking? The bottom line is:- if you're looking for a manufacturer that can do all that has been mentioned, and at a price that's not a gouge - then frankly there's little alternative.

* How many folk in "the West" have heard of Terry Gou?

Hello to all,

I am a Service engineer for Mindray UK, based in Manchester I cover the north west territory. Charles If you have any queries or question please ask away.

Mindray are certianly a company going places fast, previously I have worked for both Keymed Olympus and Baxter, as an engineer I have never worked for a company that has produced so many products in such a short period of time. Mindray are producing fresh innovative products that are proving both reliable and cost effective. The aim from what I have seen is to become a 'solution seller' covering all clinical needs.

Please visit the web site and see for yourselves, If I can be of any assistance please let me know. Mindray will also be exhibiting at the EBME seminar, I will be on hand along with sales colleagues to answer any queries people may have.

Thanks

Paul Bailey

Welcome to the forum Paul.

That was one of the best "first posts" I have seen on here for quite a while.

Keep 'em coming!

If you want 'cheap' monitors you can try DST, American owned, manufactured in America and a lot cheaper than Mindray.

DST.

Are you sure that stuff is made in the States, Neil? It has that "Made in China" look about it to me.

It would be nice to take a look at one of those monitors (open it up, I mean).

And I wonder how (if) they can be cheaper than kit made by the willing hands of China.

Anyway Neil, surely you haven't forgotten the other option:- "good, used"!

Greetings All, Mindray equipment is a bit like marmite you either love it or hate it and thats for the clinical staff who have used it.

Darth Welder - Still living the Dream

Also dont forget that most people that have been using Datascope Kit manufactured over the last few years have been using Mindray technology! Mindray have been OEM'ing kit for Datascope, Penlon, Artema etc for quite a while.
As an agent for Mindray in the veterinary world, I may be accused of being biased so will keep my opinions to myself.
Geoff, the DST kit does look familiar and may well be OEM'd in Shenzhen...............................
Regards
Ed Bennett
Southwest Medical Ltd

Yes, Ed ... I'd lay money on it (your's preferably)! Ha, ha.

By the way, in case anyone has got the wrong idea, to my mind (oh yes, was that a pun?) kit is kit. I care not a jot where it gets made, just as long as it's what I like to call "good kit":- well designed, well made, suitably robust, fit for purpose, "maintainable" and well supported.

And (to be honest) I don't pay a great deal of heed as to whether the users "like" stuff or not, either. After all, users come, and users go ... but quality, and cost effectiveness remain. But if they want it, they buy it (nothing's going to change that). Our job is to maintain (fix) it.

What I don't like are the gougers amongst manufacturers. But I don't think we can accuse Mindray of that. Not yet, anyway.

@Darth: I know there have been a few cut-backs, but I'm still trying to work out what it is the clinical staff use Marmite for.

Hi Charles,

We have a some Mindray installs in this region, both monitoring and anaesthetics. While there were a few issues with the screens on the VS800 at first these have been repaired and now seem fine.

All in all I don't have an issue with Mindray either from a quality or support point of view.

Dave

So are the latest Philips small monitors, they just bought Goldway Healthcare and stuck their badge on.
A lot of the big brands are now produced in China, why knock a company who is proud of being Chinese?
Robert

Thanks for your warm welcome Geoff, much appreciated!

As I have said in my previous post Mindray are a company pushing forward at a rapid rate, we have doubled our service team in the past 12 months and now feel we can give support and service equivalent to any of the leading manufacturers.

We have a passionate team of highly experienced engineers, all with high calibre backgrounds ranging from ex EBME techs to ex forces.

We all firmly believe in Mindray's products, the foundations have been set in place and the products that are ready to go to market are nothing short of fantastic, Mindray now have a vast amount of equipment at highly competitive prices, we have many large reference sites in the UK that will back me up on the build quality and service support of our products.

China is gaining both respect and power in regards to the future of medical equipment, we are the largest medical electronics company in China and from what I have seen and witnessed in my first year it is a company that is here to stay and compete with any of the more 'trusted' competitors.

As before if anyone has any question please feel free to give me a shout at p.bailey@mindray.com.

Regards to all

Paul

Who's knocking whom (or what)?

Meanwhile ... does this now mean that Philips will be charging Goldway prices?

Anyway, I believe that you guys are missing the Big Picture here. Surely the real question is:- which language should my grand-kids be learning ... Mandarin, or Cantonese?

@Paul: it's nice to see such enthusiasm. I'm sure we all wish you and the rest of the team well.

No, the "real question" here was, what do people think of Mindray equipment, experience of which, clearly, you have none as no such information has been forthcoming.

thanks for the comment Geoff...actually, what i have known for now is those things i have said...that is because it is written in their we b site...what i would like to solicit is an opinion from those who have used, or experience to use those kind of products.

Thank you very much Bailey...

Thank you for that gentle reminder, Dave.

Actually, I do have a bit of experience of Mindray monitors, so my initial comment stands:- "Made in China" ... as a euphemism for the genre.

Put simply, I find their kit to be typical of modern (contemporary) medical equipment. Tightly packed components, of course, and therefore difficult (if not impossible) to replace individually. Lots of plastic, naturally. And a bit "fiddly" (if you know what I mean). But that could just be a result of my deteriorating hand-eye co-ordination!

Not particularly rugged (the cases, that is) ... but again, just like "all the rest". I doubt that I'll be seeing many on the "donated equipment circuit" if I'm still around in fifteen years time. Even some of the ones currently in use have already seen a fair bit of Araldite. Bland (just like Japanese cars) ... but as we are talking about medical equipment, perhaps the word "functional" is more appropriate.

As we have seen, Service Support (in the UK, at least) is now good.

Just like the new cars about these days, modern medical equipment (especially "monitors") appear much the same to me. There's hardly anything to choose between them.

So the only sensible thing to do is to decide on price. This is where (for the time being at least) the *likes of Mindray score. Again as we have seen, you wouldn't be best pleased if you bought from a "trusted" brand only to discover later that you what you have in your hands was actually identical to a much cheaper product from Shenzhen.

Lastly, don't forget that if equipment is purchased cheaply then maintenance may need to be reconsidered. Put simply, it may be "cheaper to buy a new one" when the nurses drop it and it disintegrates into a number of pieces.

Happy now?

* Don't forget also that quite a few other Chinese manufacturers are available.

Yes, much more useful.

So, why did you not say this in the first place instead of going of on another rant (in this case about the rise of eastern Asia in the global manufacturing field). This is not rocket science, if someone asks a question, try to answer it!

Dave

Aye, aye Sir!

(but where's the fun in that?)

You haven't let your status as a "moderator" go to your head, then?

Meanwhile ... what I say is the truth as I see it, pure and simple. If that upsets or "offends" anyone, then perhaps they need to ask the question of themselves:- "why am I offended by the truth"? As for myself, at my stage of the game:- "Frankly, my Dear, I don't give a damn"!

As the former distributor for Mindray Monitoring within the UK (Technical Director of Artemis Medical), I feel I can speak with some certainty when I say that both the Mindray Products and company are excellent. Geoff as usual has only the most limited experience of Mindray - if any? With remarks such as "They are made in China. What else do you need to know?". This remark like others before from Geoff, borders on racist in my opinion.

I would like to support everything that Bailey has said about the company and its products. The advent of companies like Mindray and Edan have had the positive impact on pricing bringing prices by the more established companies down. This can only be a good thing for the NHS in the UK.

Regarding the build quality, Geoff it would appear has not taken apart any Mindray monitor that I am aware of. They are constructed in a solid and easy to service manner. Spare parts are very reasonably priced and supplied in a timely manner. They take quality very seriously and listen to concerns of their customers. I’ve now worked for the past 2 years within the NHS and so have no commercial motive to say the thing I do.

David Mulvey

PS. As for Geoff – “Empty vessels make the most noise”

A useful post there, David, and I thank you for that.

I won't add anything more to this thread, for fear of further deviation from the original post. But it's a pity that you felt the need to bring the word "racist" into it, in my opinion.

After all, there have been encouraging signs of late that that "card" no longer trumps all others in the UK any more, I'm pleased to say.

I still don't think Charles question has been answered. We have heard from a current engineer (Hi Paul) and a former distributor (Hi Dave), it would be good to hear from someone who has bought the products and so knows what to expect from Mindray.

We have had some on trial and, althought the clinical staff chose other makes, the engineering staff liked them. But again it would be good to hear from engineers with experience over time.

We have had a really good relationship with Datascope's engineers - some of whom are still working for Mindray.

Mick

Thanks for that Geoff...

Hi all from Malawi, I am interested in the thoughts on Mindray. We have a bit of their kit, like most of our lab equipment and 4 PM8000 monitors. The lab equipment has proven extremely good,which is partly down to the support by a local Chinaman who does a great job. Most of the machines paid for themselves in 9months and after that the CEO is VERY VERY HAPPY as it is a great income earner. They use open system reagents so we are not tied to anyone for consumables. Great in this part of the world where supply is quite a issue. As far as the monitors go, they have done very well. Even the oldest one that has taken several swan dives off the top of the anaesthesia machine, the latest one being this week. Up to now the front bezel has been broken, and this weeks effort shoved the printer door way in, shoved the CF card in and broken the eject button off. A direct hit I think! And it still works a treat. Some of the original cables have needed to be replaced early, but the longer I am here the worse other brands seem to do by comparison. Recently, without technical advice, adcom bought a bunch of Chinese (Carewell) equipment. Hmm, if you consider Mindray to be rather Chinese, then Carewell will be a real eye opener! Nasty stuff, useless manuals, rubbish tech support, yes we bought 5 units, 3 needs spare parts from new. But cheap, and yes they eventually worked. The opinion being that until the local staff can look after kit, so if they can break Sp02 then it might as well be a cheapy, than an expensive one. From a technical stand point it is certainly not in the league of medical electronics that we all have become used to, it is more like working on a getto blaster. Best left alone!! Mindray on the other hand I find nice to open and work on. Mindray is listed on the NY stock exchange so cant be too bad. Yes, I would like the hospital to buy more Mindray than the other stuff that has recently arrived. They have a great range of cables to suit many different sensors. I was really chuffed that they did an IBP lead to suit the Edwards life sciences sensors that we have boxes of so our new ICU looks really trick. That is my two bobs worth anyway. Cheers

That's the Idea!...Not all Made in China is lousy...

Meanwhile ... does this now mean that Philips will be charging Goldway prices?


No...they charge Philips Price for Goldway Products

Hi Charles

we have been a datascope user for many years and have been using the Mindray monitors for approximately 2 years, they have been very reliable and to my knowledge we haven't have one fail yet. The area's they are being used look after their equipment so they don't get knocked about like some monitors on the wards.

i know they are made in China but like most electronic equipment if they are'nt made in China most of the components are!!!

regards

richard

Hi Robert,
How are you? Is Jerry Bao here. I am working in Philips UK, responsible to the Goldway patient monitors sales.
Philips does NOT badge on the Goldway monitors.

NO compromising on Philips Quality, Goldway monitors offer the essential specificatins at affordable prices. Find out more here:
https://www.ebme.co.uk/news/pr/Saving_lives_and_money_-_t.html

And if you want to know more, please do not hesitate to contact me anytime, jerry.bao@philips.com

Hi Geoff, , unfortunately, Philips will NOT be charging at Goldway Prices. IntelliVue is 100% R&D and produced in German. And SureSigns 100% come from USA. And Goldway as the third sub-brand, made in China with Philips quality guaranty. Same method as iPhone.

Hello Jerry ... having just taken a look at your website, all I can say is that I'm deeply impressed by what is probably the best CV I have ever seen. I'm humbled. So let me please offer my sincere respects on that point.

So ... OK (as you are multi-lingual yourself) ... which language?

Hi all,
Thanks for the attention to Goldway. Goldway as one of the Philips patient monitor brands, now it is available in UK/Ireland market.
As Philips Value Segment products, Goldway delivers quality and core spec to suit your budgetary requirements. Should you be interested to know more or get a trial, please do not hesitate to contact me directly. jerry.bao@philips.com
Goldway models can be found in https://www.ebme.co.uk/products/index.php
Many thanks.

HI Geoff, sorry, the personal website is too much decorative. Never can match you and other experts level here.

I could speak both Mandarin and Cantonese since I grow up in Shenzhen. DO not be worry about the Chinese, since most educated Chinese can speak English. After all, English is the first international language.

oh, sorry to hear this, but I believe it is not correct. At least, not for UK. Goldway is available in the new NHS framework (both Supply Chain & Scotland), therefore, all UK customers welcome to check them out.

Hi Jerry,

I will get in contact off forum when I have a moment. I presume you are now living back in the UK.

Philips own Goldway do they not? Is it a way of producing a range of affordable monitors to extend the Philips portfolio? With the Intelivue range at the top and Goldway at the lower end - in both specification and price.
I was always inpressed by the Mindray monitors which seemed to come in when people in the west were still cautious of Chinese products butt hey were definitely made up to a standard not just down to a cheap price. I presume the Goldway ones are similar.

Robert

@Jerry:- Parlez-vous français?

@Robert:- Don't worry, once the market has been conquered, and everyone else has been squeezed out, the prices will undoubtedly rise.

Come back on here in five years time and tell me I'm wrong!

I'm no expert by the way, Jerry. Hard-bitten, experienced, observer, commentator ... those I'll allow.

HIHI, Robert, Yes, I moved back to UK. Life full of surprise. Maybe, bringing the value quality product to UK is my destiny. A destiny to make everyone happy!

Hi Jerry

Do Philips-Goldway still offer product support for old Goldway Patient Monitors?

Charles

Hello Charles,
Mindray has been manufacturing Ultrasound machines for more than a decade. Also FYI Mindray a while ago bought DATASCOPE, which I am sure you are aware of how reliable their vital monitors are.

Actually I am in the process of evaluating Mindray for their Anesthesia and Transport Monitor machines for our department.

Yes they are based in china no doubt but they are FDA, ISO, UL approved. They are new in the Anesthesia and Vital Signs monitoring arena.

Please rest assured that not all PARTS in the Phillips IntelliVue MPs are made in Germany.

Don't get me wrong the intelliVue MPs are great but its like buying a Mercedes. I wish Phillips monitors were much more affordable.

Thanks
Tim

Interesting why Mindray bought out DATASCOPE..any ideas??

Hello Folks,
We are currently evaluating Mindray for their following products:

Mindray Transport Monitoring: DPM4
Mindray Anesthesia Machine: A5

Does anyone have any experience with these above systems? Your feedback would be highly appreciated.

Cheers
Tim

Hi Timsta, welcome to the forum.
Please use the 'edit' function rather than multi-posting.

Thanks.

Please rest assured that not all PARTS in the Phillips IntelliVue MPs are made in Germany.


I'm aware of this Tim...not only those company that you have mentioned but many more are already investing in production in china...

Charles,

Would you include Drager as well in that list?

Thanks

Right Tim, not only in Bio-medical equipments but almost all of electronics, mechanical, even food and drugs...almost all of these are already produced in china...

Hello Tim,

Any feedback about the A5 anesthesia Machine?...

Thank you...

hello to all
the mindray equipments are less quality off the other equipment the probabilities off faillor are haier then the other
i have 07 mindray T8 modular monitor and i have problems all the time with capno module after 02 month of use it had been replaced for 04 of them and the qualities of accessories are mediocre
this is may experience with mindray
at alles they have a nice screen and a good qualitie of images
thinks

Sami,
I was more interested to hear the response in regards to the Mindray A5 anesthesia machines.

Have you informed Mindray of the serious issues you have encountered and have you also informed the FDA with such issues with the Mindray T8 modular.

For the past 2 years Mindray A5 has no record of FDA recalls. We were looking at their V21 but we opted for Philips IntelliVue MP70s and MX800s. But these come with a very high price..

Thanks

Our friend is in Tunisia. Somehow I doubt that the writ of the mighty FDA runs that far!

Believe it or not, there are still biomeds out there in the world who crack on and address "issues" (presumably meaning defects, real or perceived) - often with only limited resources to hand - without sitting around waiting for official sanction. That is, they actually repair (or at least attempt to repair) the kit when it's broken!

Geoff,
These Monitors have gone through FDA process since they are also in the US market.

Furthermore anyone can access the FDA website and send a complaint. Such issues should be reported so that we as users are aware of it and able to put pressure on manufacturers to resolve these issues.

We should have global recalls on medical devices. Here is some news that FDA announced recently.

http://www.fda.gov/downloads/MedicalDevices/DeviceRegulationandGuidanc
e/UniqueDeviceIdentification/UCM235964.pdf>

http://www.fda.gov/NewsEvents/Newsroom/PressAnnouncements/ucm310505

Thanks
Tim

Hi - as a biomed that works in a remote and very harsh region and has experience of a lot of Mindray equipment both imaging, anaesthesia and monitoring perhaps i can put my two bobs worth in.

I have done both repair and waranty service on their ultrasounds due to distance and the service information has been shared freely, the parts supplied in a timely manner and I have been impressed with the quality of the build and robustness of the ultrasounds in particular.
With the monitors they have the same issue as most manufacturerers now in that everything is on one or two boards and a fault outside of warranty generally means big expense replacing the board - but that means also the repair is completed quickly as you can be confident all faults have been found and fixed so the machine spends less downtime - my issues have been large cooling vents that allow vermin entry - BBQ lizard anyone (literally)but more cooling less likelihood of heat stress so that a good thing. Like all manufacturers the cases are flimsy but at least the circuit boards are screwed down not encased in polystyrene that is like a rubiks cube to reassemble and vermin love for lunch. Anaesthesia machines are supported by a company in our region that used to manufacture their own (Ulco) and they do a great job. The gas benches use high quality European sensor mechanisms inside their own (Mindray) case and work well provided you keep them clean. Overall I would be happy to use Mindray in my hospitals except that I have a better economic deal from a well known American manufacturer who manufactures in Asia - China and India funnily enough and I have standardised - so In my humble opinion Mindray are a welcome player on the market and after about five years experience with them in several countries and environments I have no negative experiences.

Hello Andy,

I am truly thankful for your input on Mindray's performance as a global vendor that means a lot to me.

However its ironic that even though GE's Anesthesia machines are manufactured in Asia we still are quoted by their reps as one of the expensive high end machines. For instance the GE Datex/Ohmeda Aisys Anesthesia system which is a high end tier is one of the most expensive machine in the high level tier. On top of the the biomed training and spare parts are just way too expensive. It's disappointing that GE sells their equipment to their own local people at a premium price.

In regards to the Mindrays Ultrasound unit especially the portable ones are excellent. They have good quality images with solid reliable probes. I fount their portable ultrasound units to be more sturdier than then GE Portable US machines which were delicate and the probes had a susceptibility of breaking. Plus the DIOCM transport was an optional feature that you had to purchase on the GE laptops which is not fun. Funyn things is that most of the parts on their portable US machines are made in China and the US probes are also re-manufactured in china.

Spacelabs has launched their own Anesthesia Machine known as ARKON which will be in the US market by mid of August 2012. This machine is a mid tier level machine that will compete with A5, Prima SP2/3, Fabius, Avance etc.

Again thank you so much for your input and suggestions.

Cheers
Tim

Thanks tim,

i will watch with interest for the Spacelabs machine

Yes the issue I had with Mindray ultrasounds is that they are too well built - i had to change the CPU board on one and found it took nearly an hour to dismantle all the other boards and carriers to access the board. needs to be done with no distractions so you dont end up with screws left over but boy was it solidly built.

its dissapointing that some companys make biomed training so difficult, especially the high end companies - we find that because we only want a few machines they wont usually include supprot training in CAPEX quotes - I have a lot of experience and enough friends I can usually manage to access service info but it would be much better coming from source. Thats why I favour companies like Mindray who will share service info and recognise that I cant afford the several weeks it takes to ship a machine back to their service agent in Australia for repair - we need the machine pronto as we dont have back up. Its off topic I know but it is a major consideration when I am doing procurement recommendations.

Hi all, first post on here, you're all very welcome (",)

I work within clinical engineering for the NHS. We have a lot of mindray products mainly patient monitoring ie Accutorr V passport V. from my experience they have improved on the old datascope accutorr passports ect. The servicing has become easier (although I wont tell my boss that) and breakdowns are happening less. We have just had some of the Datascope trio replacements IPM8 fitted in our A&E department and they seem to be doing very well. Mindray UK headquaters are always on hand and the technical support I recieved from them is very good, there Technical training courses are well put together and last time I got a memory stick and a umbrella!

Hello Paul
Well I am glad that we have another competitor that can compete with the big giants such as GE Healthcare, Philips Medical and Siemens.

Actually Datascope was Mindrays product, they were the OEM manufacturers. Now since Datascope is owned by Mindray I am sure they will improve their products even more.

Andy
Oh just heard that Philips Medical will be launching their new Anesthesia Machine product line by the name of DAMECA.. see how that goes..

Cheers

Spacelabs bought Blease so no surprise they are producing anaesthetic machines but Philips entering the gas market is interesting. They bought Respironics but they have only ever produced domiciliary vents to my knowledge.
Have Philips bought someone up as it is unlikely they are designing from scratch?
Robert

Philips Siesta anaesthetic (anesthesia) machines.


Philips have bought Dameca. Anyone know anything about the company?
Robert

Yes. Quality kit from Denmark.

But now about to be subsumed into corporate blandness, no doubt.

Nothing to do with Mindray, though.

See here.

Hello Guys,

Its alright if sometimes we have discussed off to the topic, but it is still welcome, this thread is all about evaluation, and evaluation needs some referrence. how is this kind compare with others...so i think we were still in the right track...

Keep going...

More power and many thanks to those who have shared.


Yours Truly;
Charles

hi everyone. about mindray blood chem analyzer BS88A, may i ask where to buy blood chem analyzer reagents for BS88A here in the Philippines? hope you can help. salamat

Boboy,

just keep in touch, i will try if i can find a contact for you with regards to that reagents. my suggestion is use mindray reagents too...others might offer generics brands to you but i doubt on the integrity of examination results...

Charles